That is a false choice and a severely limiting attitude. Few successful business people had that attitude. It's like defining all automobiles as either sports cars or minivans. There are many different markets, and within each market there are sub-markets. People cross the lines between markets all the time. Your classification fails horribly, especially considering people can play "hardcore" games, and follow it up immediately with a "casual" game.

So no, it is not accurate, it also doesn't work.[/quote]

I think I came out wrong on how I said it. Gamers are a mix of both now, have been for awhile. It wasnt like this on last gen. ''Hardcore'' gamers can and will probably do as you said, thats why I said that most people would have a Wii too. To try the experience. But the ones who bought the Wii, the non-gamers that Nintendo wanted to atract, and did well doing so, probably wont be playing those ''hardcore'' games or any other game that doesent have Nintendo on its title or made by Nintendo, for that matter.

Just Dance 2 sold 5 mil, all other third party games are below 2mil. I dont know if what im sayin makes much sence to everyone. Ill just put it like this, There's 85Million+ Wii's in households worldwide. But only 1% to 6% of the customers actually buy anything not related to Nintendo, as in, third party games. The numbers are good, but not when the total of people that might buy your game is from 0.1% to 6% of all Wii console owners worldwide. Nintendo knows its market, we all know its market. Casual gamers. Make something cute and slightly entertaining and youl get buyers. The same as the smartphone and browser markets which, Nintendo is afraid of. And Sony should too. Why get a 3DS or an NGP when I can do everything on my phone? And soon from my phone to my HDTV. For a fraction of the cost.

Again, that's a false choice. You are assuming mutually exclusive or limited options where none exists. Look at the huge number of people who own multiple consoles.[/quote]

Im saying why get something similar and new when A) You already have a console on your house with the capabilities or B) Theres a console already on the market with a gamepad and Motion controls, atleast thats what I was refering too...

The gamepad certainly does not work "on all most all genres". Music games? Dance games? Motion games? Racing games? Flight games? Sports games? All have custom controllers.[/quote]

Almost* My bad. Music? Parapa the Rapper. Dance, ofcourse not. Wiimote? lol... Racing? Erm...Gran Turismo 1-5? Forza 1-3? Im pretty sure the games where great with the gamepad. Flight? PS3 got that covered in Warhawk I think. Sports? We have played sport games for decades now...whats wrong with the gamepad? You have to think about the people, the user. Some games are good for the whole motion thing but others are horrible. A gamepad allows many options and support for almost all games. Its unique, its innovative but is it good?

Many genres have been crying out for new controllers for years, and I know I've been among them. Many games like puzzle games and local multiplayer games can see great benefits from a private display. Not to mention that a novel interface allows for new genres to be created.[/quote]

True. Id like another Steel Battalion(Xbox1 Mech game, huge controler) myself. Sadly tho, the sequel is going to use Kinect...

You said you would bet against it succeeding. That is a very odd thing to bet on. I wouldn't. If anything I'd be tempted to bet the other way. Nintendo has a very solid track record. They know their audiences. They know them very well. They have consistently delivered products that perform very well in the market. No other game company, and very few companies generally, can boast of such solid records.I think your mixed attitude is funny. On the one hand you are excited about it, but on the other had you think it will fail. That's a very interesting attitude to take. If people are excited that as often all it takes to succeed.
[/quote]

Yes, I bet it wont be succeeding. I dont question Nintendo's Wii success or its handheld market. Other than now with the 3DS, but I still belive what I have said above. If you are not Nintendo, you dont have a % of 85M customers, more like a % of 5Million. The Wii is more like a Casual Console, take out Mario and some of the MAIN franchises, and thats what your left with. It has its glory but I also remember a survey talking about how much time do people really spend playing with their consoles. Wii had the lowest. And what more can we innovate? We have the usual gamepad, with have motion controls and motion sensing ''controls''. We also have touch based controls. This is what makes it exciting for me. What will Nintendo do and will it work? Someone said something about a PowerGlove type thing, but is that really innovating? Sounds like what the Wiimote and PSMove is. Maybe its innovation will be more on how the console works instead of how we play the games in it. This is my guess, my speculation. Maybe it will be some sort of tablet where you just ''stream'' the content into the screen, Like what the ''superphone's'' will do in the soon to be future. Will something like that work for the demographic that they brought with the Wii?

The sky is falling! I got a -1 post. Oh teh noes!
More likely you were rated down because of a combative attitude and a hardline stance against those who presented alternate views.[/quote]

Probably because I am a combatant lol...I spoke my mind, gave my opinion and I acknowledged everyones opinion. This is an opinion thread, I dont see why my or anyones ''reputation'' should be lowered or raised, based on this. And much less when you just get rated down with no comment. Rate me badly is I tell someone to start programming with Assembly or BASIC. Or if I or anyone gives a bad suggestion. But for an opinion? In a non-technical thread? But whatever, I for one feel like I have had bad luck here(GD.net) since my first thread and for no reason. And that this might make it worse, if thats possible lol

.

First. You're alive! Good to see you.

Second. Yeah, but if we did that, it'd be no fun talking about rumors.

[quote name='frob']The gamepad certainly does not work "on all most all genres". Music games? Dance games? Motion games? Racing games? Flight games? Sports games? All have custom controllers.

Your argument seems (to me) to be that Nintendo can't count on having many people buy the Wii 2. But I just don't see much justification for that [/quote]

My argument is that people bought the Wii because what it brought. Easier way to play and different. The mass market appeal. And most games are pretty casual, easy to play and dont take much to finish. In a way, its like the overall casual game market that you find now, in the millions, in phones and browsers. This worked on 2006, pre Iphone/Android time. But will something similar to the Wii work again? I doubt it. Why? Because of the same reason most people dont update their browsers. It does pretty much the same thing, right? Why do it? And not only that, we have Kinect and Sony's Move. And smartphones and Ipod's and Tablets. Their competition, Nintendo's, is more challenging now. Sony and MS dont have this problem. They know their market and it will remain the same till who knows what. Nintendo's market is huge now. But can they maintain it? Thats my question. And my answer, as you already know is, I think not. Not at all. (EDIT: Forgot to mention that it depends on what they do. Can they really innovate something better than what is out there?)

You missed his point. The gamepad is a compromise for all of these genres, which is why dedicated input devices like the DDR dance mat, a plethora of racing wheels and pedals, joysticks and throttles and more exist. Do you actually play sports games? The control schemes continue to get more and more byzantine in an attempt to reflect the nuance of the games - the shot stick, FreeStyle™ control in EA Sports games, icon passing... It's a mess that favors long-time gamers and makes games harder for novices to approach.[/quote]

I think I did. I thought we were talking more about the Wiimote and Gamepad's. As in the market for each console. Dedicated Input Devices are great, but its not mass market as in this case. A gamepad or a wiimote. But if you had to choose one to play most genres what would you go for? Personally I belive that the gamepad fits most games well. Having a wiimote type device alone, I belive, limits the games that the devs can develop. Not all games are suited for motion controls, I belive. But this is a design decision. And makes my view and everyones, mute. No? Because the Wii has that support, even tho I dont like the GC control much. But to end this, there will never be a perfect ''control'' that fits every game. Options are a great thing to have, from the start. Dev's just have to use them. This is why I like what Sony and MS did now. Good gamepad + motion stuff. They hit almost every angle and very well. I dont play sport games, but I have, on the PS3. It felt good, ''normal'', like they used to. It was a basketball game. How does a basketball game feel on the Wii?

You missed his point. The gamepad is a compromise .... It's a mess that favors long-time gamers and makes games harder for novices to approach.

I dont play sport games, but I have, on the PS3. It felt good, ''normal'', like they used to. It was a basketball game. How does a basketball game feel on the Wii?
[/quote]

Apparently you missed it again. Your last statement about how it feels on the Wii is like pulling defeat from the jaws of victory. That is EXACTLY the point, yet you completely missed it.

Active sports games were specifically called out on page 1 of the discussion by people who DO play the games as something that could see a huge benefit from a touch-screen controller.

[quote name='xDxReaper' timestamp='1304034738' post='4804204']

You missed his point. The gamepad is a compromise .... It's a mess that favors long-time gamers and makes games harder for novices to approach.

I dont play sport games, but I have, on the PS3. It felt good, ''normal'', like they used to. It was a basketball game. How does a basketball game feel on the Wii?
[/quote]

Apparently you missed it again. Your last statement about how it feels on the Wii is like pulling defeat from the jaws of victory. That is EXACTLY the point, yet you completely missed it.

Active sports games were specifically called out on page 1 of the discussion by people who DO play the games as something that could see a huge benefit from a touch-screen controller.
[/quote]
I actually don't enjoy sports games on most consoles but have a lot of fun playing them on the wii. The ones that don't try to play to families and actually try to be good sports games I find to be a lot closer to what a sports game should be; not a sports game made for shooter gamers. That's probably on account of having to redesign them with new interface. I'm hearing a lot of really good things about the next madden wii too.

Isn't this far too early to be saying whether a system is worth it due to some speculation on specs and the controller?